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 | | From: | Steve Spence | | Subject: | Prototype Bioreactor for Hydrogen Production | | Date: | Wed, 19 Jan 2005 16:56:27 GMT |
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 | http://www.greencarcongress.com/2005/01/prototype_biore.html
Infectech, a Pennsylvania biotech company, is developing a prototype
bioreactor to produce hydrogen with the Department of Environmental
Science and Engineering of Gannon University in Erie, PA.
Originally founded in 1989 for the development of diagnostic kits for
infectious diseases, Infectech is diversifying into technologies for the
production of alternative sources of fuel and the remediation of toxic
materials.
There are two basic approaches to the microbial production of hydrogen:
fermentative and photosynthetic. Clostridia species, methanogens and
archeabacteria are known fermentative producers of hydrogen, while
purple sulfur bacteria and green algae are examples of photosynthetic
producers.
Infectech proposes to use its patented bacterial culturing methods with
Clostridia for the hydrogen production.
--
Steve Spence
Dir., Green Trust
http://www.green-trust.org
Contributing Editor
http://www.off-grid.net
http://www.rebelwolf.com/essn.html
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| | From: | bernxard at yahoo.com.au | | Subject: | Re: Prototype Bioreactor for Hydrogen Production | | Date: | 22 Jan 2005 14:01:13 -0800 |
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| Thanks for that information. Do you have information on the
conversion of sunlight into biomass. I was under the impression that
misacanthus, a sort of fast growing tree was a good option, switchgrass
is apparently extremely effective, I suspect that algae is excellent.
I wasn't quite sure if the H2 producing bacteria is anaerobic or
aerobic.
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| | From: | Ed Earl Ross | | Subject: | Re: Prototype Bioreactor for Hydrogen Production | | Date: | Wed, 19 Jan 2005 20:23:09 GMT |
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| Steve Spence wrote:
> http://www.greencarcongress.com/2005/01/prototype_biore.html
>
> Infectech, a Pennsylvania biotech company, is developing a prototype
> bioreactor to produce hydrogen with the Department of Environmental
> Science and Engineering of Gannon University in Erie, PA.
>
> Originally founded in 1989 for the development of diagnostic kits for
> infectious diseases, Infectech is diversifying into technologies for the
> production of alternative sources of fuel and the remediation of toxic
> materials.
>
> There are two basic approaches to the microbial production of hydrogen:
> fermentative and photosynthetic. Clostridia species, methanogens and
> archeabacteria are known fermentative producers of hydrogen, while
> purple sulfur bacteria and green algae are examples of photosynthetic
> producers.
>
> Infectech proposes to use its patented bacterial culturing methods with
> Clostridia for the hydrogen production.
No doubt it will work to produce H2. However, I am skeptical that
it will be economically viable.
Bioreactors were investigated as early as 1951 by Jack Myers and
Neal Phillips with results in "On the Mass Culture of Algae",
available on http://www.jgp.org/. Nonetheless, most, if not all,
commercially grown algae is produced in outdoor ponds.
After many googles on "bioreactor ...", I've found much research
but no commercial installation. On the other hand, there are both
commercial and individual algae ponds, mainly to grow spirulina for
human consumption.
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| | From: | Cyril | | Subject: | Re: Prototype Bioreactor for Hydrogen Production | | Date: | Sun, 23 Jan 2005 01:43:24 +0100 |
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| Ed Earl Ross a utilisé son clavier pour dire :
>
>
>No doubt it will work to produce H2. However, I am skeptical that
>it will be economically viable.
>
And, if the principle works, CH4 production may be more enconomical.
CH4 can be sold using the huge existing natural gas infrastructure,
while H2 has a smaller market.
There are several studies about algae or microbe farming. These small
lifeforms could be grown in water, either in an open pool or in a
closed glass box, fed with CO2 (from a power plant, for instance) and
convert sunlight to energy-carrying chemicals, like methane, hydrogen,
fatty oils (to make biodiesel), sugar (used to make ethanol) and so
on.
The efficiency ( chemical energy output / sunlight input) would be
roughly one order of magnitude than with land-based plants - ie,
something like 5% instead of 0.5%, mleaning that the same amount of
biofuel could come from a tenth of the acreage.
--
« Si quelqu’un a une crise de paludisme, il suffit qu’il prenne une
pioche et aille creuser la terre au soleil pour être guéri grâce à
sa conscience politique élevée. »
POL POT
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| | From: | Ed Earl Ross | | Subject: | Re: Prototype Bioreactor for Hydrogen Production | | Date: | Sun, 23 Jan 2005 02:59:59 GMT |
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| Cyril wrote:
> Ed Earl Ross a utilisé son clavier pour dire :
>
>
>>
>>No doubt it will work to produce H2. However, I am skeptical that
>>it will be economically viable.
>>
>
>
> And, if the principle works, CH4 production may be more enconomical.
> CH4 can be sold using the huge existing natural gas infrastructure,
> while H2 has a smaller market.
Yes, methane generators are one method of biomass conversion to
energy, used daily throughout the world, in both developed and
underdeveloped regions.
> There are several studies about algae or microbe farming. These small
> lifeforms could be grown in water, either in an open pool or in a
> closed glass box, fed with CO2 (from a power plant, for instance) and
> convert sunlight to energy-carrying chemicals, like methane, hydrogen,
> fatty oils (to make biodiesel), sugar (used to make ethanol) and so
> on.
Algae for biodiesel and CO2 sequestration is promising, in general.
Currently, there are niche applications for algae and biodiesel
production. It is unclear to me, what oil prices must be to make
biodiesel less expensive than petroleum diesel. IMO it will happen.
Currently diatoms (an algae) are being investigated for biodiesel
and other things, including medicine. My web search on diatoms is
ongoing, but it appears more basic research about them is needed to
be able to manage large scale diatom farms economically. Diatom
study includes species that like to attach themselves to coral, sea
weed , or strip of plastic. Thus harvesting diatoms is more
complicated than pumping them from the sea, or a pond.
Diatom microbiologists and nanotech scientists are sharing
information common to both, apparently with great enthusiasm, but I
have no details.
> The efficiency ( chemical energy output / sunlight input) would be
> roughly one order of magnitude than with land-based plants - ie,
> something like 5% instead of 0.5%, mleaning that the same amount of
> biofuel could come from a tenth of the acreage.
Absolutely, that is why algae are a hot topic right now. The
highest figure I've read for diatom production is 60g /(m2 da), but
that level of production is not currently sustainable on a large
scale.
> --
> « Si quelqu’un a une crise de paludisme, il suffit qu’il prenne une
> pioche et aille creuser la terre au soleil pour être guéri grâce à
> sa conscience politique élevée. »
> POL POT
Humbly--Ed
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| | From: | Bob Eldred | | Subject: | Re: Prototype Bioreactor for Hydrogen Production | | Date: | Thu, 20 Jan 2005 08:32:05 -0800 |
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"Steve Spence" wrote in message
news:%iwHd.33069$Xs6.10331@twister.nyroc.rr.com...
> http://www.greencarcongress.com/2005/01/prototype_biore.html
>
> Infectech, a Pennsylvania biotech company, is developing a prototype
> bioreactor to produce hydrogen with the Department of Environmental
> Science and Engineering of Gannon University in Erie, PA.
>
> Originally founded in 1989 for the development of diagnostic kits for
> infectious diseases, Infectech is diversifying into technologies for the
> production of alternative sources of fuel and the remediation of toxic
> materials.
>
> There are two basic approaches to the microbial production of hydrogen:
> fermentative and photosynthetic. Clostridia species, methanogens and
> archeabacteria are known fermentative producers of hydrogen, while
> purple sulfur bacteria and green algae are examples of photosynthetic
> producers.
>
> Infectech proposes to use its patented bacterial culturing methods with
> Clostridia for the hydrogen production.
>
>
> --
> Steve Spence
> Dir., Green Trust
> http://www.green-trust.org
>
> Contributing Editor
> http://www.off-grid.net
> http://www.rebelwolf.com/essn.html
Are there any specifics of this such as yields, cost analysis, etc? Second
question: Why the hell would they want to make hydrogen when methane is
readily made by bacteria from biomass? Methane has a much higher volumetric
energy density than hydrogen and is a much more useful fuel. Because the
carbon in the biomass is part of the energy yield, the efficiency and
effectiveness of making methane will necessarily be greater than any scheme
making hydrogen. What happens to the carbon in a hydrogen bio-system?
Bob
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| | From: | Ed Earl Ross | | Subject: | Re: Prototype Bioreactor for Hydrogen Production | | Date: | Thu, 20 Jan 2005 18:39:50 GMT |
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| Bob Eldred wrote:
> "Steve Spence" wrote in message
> news:%iwHd.33069$Xs6.10331@twister.nyroc.rr.com...
>
>>http://www.greencarcongress.com/2005/01/prototype_biore.html
>>
>>Infectech, a Pennsylvania biotech company, is developing a prototype
>>bioreactor to produce hydrogen with the Department of Environmental
>>Science and Engineering of Gannon University in Erie, PA.
>>
>>Originally founded in 1989 for the development of diagnostic kits for
>>infectious diseases, Infectech is diversifying into technologies for the
>>production of alternative sources of fuel and the remediation of toxic
>>materials.
>>
>>There are two basic approaches to the microbial production of hydrogen:
>>fermentative and photosynthetic. Clostridia species, methanogens and
>>archeabacteria are known fermentative producers of hydrogen, while
>>purple sulfur bacteria and green algae are examples of photosynthetic
>>producers.
>>
>>Infectech proposes to use its patented bacterial culturing methods with
>>Clostridia for the hydrogen production.
>>
>>
>>--
>>Steve Spence
>>Dir., Green Trust
>>http://www.green-trust.org
>>
>>Contributing Editor
>>http://www.off-grid.net
>>http://www.rebelwolf.com/essn.html
>
>
> Are there any specifics of this such as yields, cost analysis, etc?
Good question. There are previous published studies on algae growth
in bioreactors. However, this may be a first for the species of
marine algae being used in this research. Moreover, they may have a
novel bioreactor design in mind. I suspect we must wait for the
research results to be published, unless someone has insider
knowledge and is willing and able to share it.
>Second
> question: Why the hell would they want to make hydrogen when methane is
> readily made by bacteria from biomass? Methane has a much higher volumetric
> energy density than hydrogen and is a much more useful fuel. Because the
> carbon in the biomass is part of the energy yield, the efficiency and
> effectiveness of making methane will necessarily be greater than any scheme
> making hydrogen. What happens to the carbon in a hydrogen bio-system?
IMHO: It is politically correct for government agencies to sponsor
H2 research, and researchers like to take government money.
> Bob
Humbly--Ed
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| | From: | bernxard at yahoo.com.au | | Subject: | Re: Prototype Bioreactor for Hydrogen Production | | Date: | 19 Jan 2005 15:52:24 -0800 |
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| My old girlfriends father who was an ethnic German from Romania before
they were all ethnically cleansed studied for part of his civil
engineering degree Germany before the second world war.
He described to me a sewage treatment plant for extracting methane from
human sewage that was in used for many years near the city of Frankfurt
near the Rhine River. 5 very large tanks were filled with sewage and
left to ferment under appropirate conditions. Every so often a crane
would lift a special lid onto a particular unit and this would then
supply a substantial amount of methane that was used to generate power
in a steam plant.
I guess with an innoculation of the correct bacteria such a plant could
produce hydrogne instead of methane.
I suspect the reason such schemes are not now practised now is not
because they are not energetically viable but simply because fossile
fuel is so cheap and the technology needs to improve.
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| | From: | Ed Earl Ross | | Subject: | Re: Prototype Bioreactor for Hydrogen Production | | Date: | Thu, 20 Jan 2005 02:13:13 GMT |
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| bernxard@yahoo.com.au wrote:
> My old girlfriends father who was an ethnic German from Romania before
> they were all ethnically cleansed studied for part of his civil
> engineering degree Germany before the second world war.
>
> He described to me a sewage treatment plant for extracting methane from
> human sewage that was in used for many years near the city of Frankfurt
> near the Rhine River. 5 very large tanks were filled with sewage and
> left to ferment under appropirate conditions. Every so often a crane
> would lift a special lid onto a particular unit and this would then
> supply a substantial amount of methane that was used to generate power
> in a steam plant.
>
> I guess with an innoculation of the correct bacteria such a plant could
> produce hydrogne instead of methane.
>
> I suspect the reason such schemes are not now practised now is not
> because they are not energetically viable but simply because fossile
> fuel is so cheap and the technology needs to improve.
>
Methane production has been used for many years, and is the
mainstay of biomass energy production, even today.
The bacteria used in this process does not require light. Whereas,
the only bacteria known to produce H2 is algae, which requires
light, for example sunlight.
Though sunlight is abundant, the energy density per m3 is only
about 750w/m2 (1hp/yd2). Ideally, a yd2 algae surface would run a 1
hp engine, while the sun shines. However, systems are much less
efficient than ideal (100% efficient). In the real world you might
get a 0.1hp engine to run. The sun has a lot of energy that algae
cannot use, and the engine is perhaps 35% efficient. Consequently,
you need more than 1 yd2 per hp, probably more than 10 y2.
Unfortunately, algae bioreactors are more complex than a methane
unit, and probably cannot be made as small.
Scientists are looking for new bacteria, perhaps they will find an
ideal one. Moreover, it may be possible to genetically engineer
one. It would be a good day for anyone who discovers that microbe.
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